學士瀛洲

聨吟客

白老師詮注本走法
[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999999939999982637266999999316599996050404142591099499999794748[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_title] 竹香齋 學士瀛洲[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_result]红先和[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]31415041727060827010473763333738333848383938494738484787665659674838674638488784484784444757445457477969[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_comment26]黑優[/DhtmlXQ_comment26]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_11_1]3949596766367969101969591959384849396759[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_11_1][DhtmlXQ_comment1_20]||黑勝[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_20]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_7_2]6668594763234838394947684959684759584766585979695949667823533747101869595359384849397859[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_7_2][DhtmlXQ_comment2_28]黑勝[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_28]
[DhtmlXQ_move_2_9_3]1018796963534858184858485357695957594768[/DhtmlXQ_move_2_9_3][DhtmlXQ_comment3_18]||黑勝[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_18]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D57479%26extra%3Dpage%253D1[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

聨吟客

但不知最後是紅可和還是黑有勝法呢

有些別的詮注本 有修改局  但也沒有說原局黑勝
如果黑不能勝為何要修改呢

而且修改局又喪失假象陷阱  我不喜歡

白老師詮注本無修改局   結論也只說黑優

幾種詮注本看下來都沒給出明確的結論  

而我又棋力不精   所以一直搞不清楚此局究竟能不能和

呵呵呵   各位同好高手  能否指導以解我多年之疑惑

聨吟客

我有三種詮注本  綜合如下  都沒有說到底黑能不能勝 呵呵
[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999999939999982637266999999316599996050404142591099499999794748[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_12_4]494738484787665659674838674638488784484784444757445457477969[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_12_4]
[DhtmlXQ_title] 竹香齋 學士瀛洲[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_result]红先和[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]3141504172706082701047376333373833384838393849193848596748476746[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_comment4_26]黑優[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_26]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_11_1]3949596766367969101969591959384849396759[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_11_1]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_20]||黑勝[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_20]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_7_2]6668594763234838394947684959684759584766585979695949667823533747101869595359384849397859[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_7_2]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_28]黑勝[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_28]
[DhtmlXQ_move_2_9_3]1018796963534858184858485357695957594768[/DhtmlXQ_move_2_9_3]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_18]||黑勝[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment16]黑方占優[/DhtmlXQ_comment16][DhtmlXQ_comment12]陸曙光先生詮注本走法[/DhtmlXQ_comment12][DhtmlXQ_comment4_12]白宏寬 周平先生詮注本走法[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_12]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_12_5]49433837[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_12_5][DhtmlXQ_comment5_13]以後局勢黑方較優||紅方也還可支撐[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_13][DhtmlXQ_comment5_12]裘望禹 蔣權 朱鶴洲||詮注本注3走法[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_12]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D57487%26extra%3Dpage%253D1[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

聨吟客

陸曙光詮注本的修改局  是否有問題
[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999999939996582637266999999319999996050404142591099499999784748[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_1_1]314150417270608270104737633337383338483839495967101838484939674665474627182878686667274667576858285848583938[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_1_1]
[DhtmlXQ_title] 竹香齋 學士瀛洲 陸曙光詮注本修改局[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_result]红先和[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]631348383949[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_27]和[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_27]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D57487%26extra%3Dpage%253D1[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

聨吟客

這個改局喪失了假象陷阱
[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999999939379982837286999999316599996050404142590099999999794748[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_title] 竹香齋 學士瀛洲 裘望禹 蔣權 朱鶴洲
詮注本修改局[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_result]红先和[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]3141504172706082700047378688483839493747000859678343796988684748084838484348695949596748[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_comment22]和[/DhtmlXQ_comment22]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//hgchess.com/bbs/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D57487%26extra%3Dpage%253D1[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

聨吟客

5樓怎麼沒顯示標題  呵呵  是裘望禹 蔣權 朱鶴洲  三人詮注本的改局

yjr123

优就是好走一些，但还不足以致胜。
再说明白一点就是和棋。

聨吟客

黑優而紅也能守和的江湖局  應該就是不錯的局吧

既然如此  為何上述的其中兩種詮注譜要做修改呢

而且改得ㄧ局紅簡單勝  一局喪失了假象陷阱

這是我百思不得其解的地方   ????????????

但不知還有無其他人的詮注本是什麼狀況的?呵呵

聨吟客

雪泥鴻爪1中 周廣程先生所擬的黑勝法

[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999999939999982637266999999316599996050404142591099499999794748[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_title] 竹香齋 學士瀛洲  周廣程先生擬著  [/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_result]红先和[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]3141504172706082701047376333373833384838393849433837596766364132101542203747675536564341150555360535204247373617565379695363172937386959635342605323405023736042735341013555504055454260533301004547404133354142353342524727004027472917472732413323170527255969383705243738524225274030656482642747425223212436473736173727172527474132384830404757254657474634475732415747413048383426472752422122304122024050021250301202261402014132013114263839695939384241383941312737314137305949[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_comment4_26]黑優[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_26]
[DhtmlXQ_comment20]||黑勝[/DhtmlXQ_comment20]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_28]黑勝[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_28]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_18]||黑勝[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment118]黑勝[/DhtmlXQ_comment118]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//hgchess.com/bbs/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D57487%26extra%3Dpage%253D2[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

聨吟客

我棋力低微  有看沒有懂 只好慢慢學習

不知各位高手認為 這個走法結論是否正確?

第一次有人列出完整黑勝法  難能可貴  

zhaodi

9楼在原谱中有说明：
如图是《竹香斋象戏谱》1804年版初集第65局“学士瀛洲”，在1817年版为初集第59局，原谱着法为和局，实际上是黑胜。此局经过短暂的序战（俗称“脱帽”）之后，形成红方双炮未过河兵对黑方马炮底卒单缺士的残局形势，黑方的取胜方法具有一定的实用价值
      着法：红先黑胜

周广程的着法也有可商榷之处。第9回合改退马捉兵，兵无法保，早形成双炮，红只能苟延残喘

[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999999939999982637266999999316599996050404142591099499999794748[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_18_1]42203747675536564341150555360535204247373617565379695363172937386959635342605323405023736042735341013555504055454260533301004547404133354142353342524727004027472917472732413323170527255969383705243738524225274030656482642747425223212436473736173727172527474132384830404757254657474634475732415747413048383426472752422122304122024050021250301202261402014132013114263839695939384241383941312737314137305949[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_18_1]
[DhtmlXQ_title] 竹香齋 學士瀛洲  周廣程先生擬著  [/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_result]红先和[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]3141504172706082701047376333373833384838393849433837596766364132101567461535324135454665[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_comment4_26]黑優[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_26]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_20]||黑勝[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_20]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_28]黑勝[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_28]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_18]||黑勝[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_118]黑勝[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_118]
[DhtmlXQ_comment18]此招改为退马捉兵亦可。[/DhtmlXQ_comment18][DhtmlXQ_comment22]黑胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment22]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D57487%26extra%3Dpage%253D1[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

yjr123

黑方的取胜方法具有一定的实用价值，但方法却难以表述，书中也不见方法。
黑方确实具有兵种和多士象的优势，感觉上也应该黑方可胜，但作为排局，红方可变之处太多，谱不能尽其变，读者看了和没看一样，归根结底还是要拼功底。

聨吟客

yjr123 发表于 2023-12-13 19:17
黑方的取胜方法具有一定的实用价值，但方法却难以表述，书中也不见方法。
黑方确实具有兵种和多士象的优势 ...

真是 精闢

沒聽說有攤主擺此局?   應該很適合擺吧  呵呵呵

聨吟客

   誰改的?[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999999939992982637266999999653120594241405060999949994748799999[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_pver]130606[/DhtmlXQ_pver]
[DhtmlXQ_adddate]2013-11-10 19:16:01[/DhtmlXQ_adddate]
[DhtmlXQ_editdate]2013-11-10 19:16:00[/DhtmlXQ_editdate]
[DhtmlXQ_title]第22局 学士瀛洲[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]3141504172706082702047376668483839493747202859676343474828483848434867484948[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_7_1]6333373833384838394979692023594766566959[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_7_1]
[DhtmlXQ_firstnum]0[/DhtmlXQ_firstnum]
[DhtmlXQ_length]29[/DhtmlXQ_length]
[DhtmlXQ_date]0000-00-00[/DhtmlXQ_date]
[DhtmlXQ_result]和棋[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_hits]294[/DhtmlXQ_hits]
[DhtmlXQ_sortid]7057820[/DhtmlXQ_sortid]
[DhtmlXQ_owner]桑莫喜[/DhtmlXQ_owner]
[DhtmlXQ_oldowner]桑莫喜[/DhtmlXQ_oldowner]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.dpxq.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.dpxq.com/hldcg/search/index.asp[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator][/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

聨吟客

[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999999939992982637266999999653120594241405060999949994748799999[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_8_2]483839493747202859676343474828483848434867484948[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_8_2]
[DhtmlXQ_pver]130606[/DhtmlXQ_pver]
[DhtmlXQ_adddate]2013-11-10 19:16:01[/DhtmlXQ_adddate]
[DhtmlXQ_editdate]2013-11-10 19:16:00[/DhtmlXQ_editdate]
[DhtmlXQ_title]第22局 学士瀛洲[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]314150417270608270204737666849296333483839495947684879693343695949593839595847665857292748473747[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_7_1]6333373833384838394979692023594766566959[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_7_1]
[DhtmlXQ_firstnum]0[/DhtmlXQ_firstnum]
[DhtmlXQ_length]29[/DhtmlXQ_length]
[DhtmlXQ_date]0000-00-00[/DhtmlXQ_date]
[DhtmlXQ_result]和棋[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_hits]294[/DhtmlXQ_hits]
[DhtmlXQ_sortid]7057820[/DhtmlXQ_sortid]
[DhtmlXQ_owner]桑莫喜[/DhtmlXQ_owner]
[DhtmlXQ_oldowner]桑莫喜[/DhtmlXQ_oldowner]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_9_3]2010594763234838394947684959684759497969[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_9_3][DhtmlXQ_comment8]云庫這樣走黑勝[/DhtmlXQ_comment8]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//hgchess.com/bbs/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D57487%26page%3D1%26extra%3D[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator][/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

聨吟客

既然周  趙  余  等高手都認為原局黑勝   而幾個改局都不令人滿意
雖然我還沒弄懂黑要怎麼勝  呵呵呵  也先改一個  供參考研究
[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999999939999982637266999974316599996050404142591099499999794748[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_title] 竹香齋 學士瀛洲 聨吟客添兵   [/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_result]红先和[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist][/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//hgchess.com/bbs/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D57487%26extra%3Dpage%253D1[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

聨吟客

有無撞局呢  呵呵呵
[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999999939990782637266999999316599996050404142591099499999794748[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_title] 竹香齋 學士瀛洲 聨吟客添相   [/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_result]红先和[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist][/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//hgchess.com/bbs/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D57487%26extra%3Dpage%253D1[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]