华工象棋论坛
标题: 【转贴】【征答悬赏贴】星星之火 [打印本页]
作者: 1yuanyi2 时间: 2008-12-15 17:12
标题: 【转贴】【征答悬赏贴】星星之火
转自泓弈象棋网 新赢家
[DhtmlXQ] [DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver] [DhtmlXQ_init]520,450[/DhtmlXQ_init] [DhtmlXQ_movelist][/DhtmlXQ_movelist] [DhtmlXQ_binit]76nn655949nnnnnnnnnn79nnnnnnnn86nn41nn304252nnnn4046nn38nn370357[/DhtmlXQ_binit] [DhtmlXQ_title]征答悬赏贴：星星之火[/DhtmlXQ_title] [DhtmlXQ_type]残局[/DhtmlXQ_type] [DhtmlXQ_result]未知[/DhtmlXQ_result] [DhtmlXQ_refer]www.lshh.net[/DhtmlXQ_refer] [/DhtmlXQ]
关于《征答悬赏贴：星星之火》的说明：
1、“星星之火”为艺术青光软剑棋友根据“高枕无忧”等残局改编，是精妙的构思之局，其中隐藏很多复杂的变化，令我深入其中。几经把玩，不能自拔。为与象棋爱好者一道共同穷尽其变，特由本人征答悬赏。着法为红先，结果待定。
2、凡从今日起至2009年1月16日0点0分参与对“星星之火”跟帖解答的棋友的帖子均列为应答贴。本人将于2009年1月26日对着法最完善的应答贴进行公布，并予以人民币500元的鼓励。
3、所有应答贴均在本主题帖下跟贴，另开的主题帖无效。
4、完善的应答贴只取一个，如有两贴相同的，以发表时间列在前的计取。
5、感谢艺术青光软剑棋友创作并提供了“星星之火”棋局。艺术青光软剑棋友拟出的初步变化参见《星星之火（小和局）》target=_blank>http://www.hychess.com/bbs/viewthread.php?tid=7112&;extra=page%3D1
作者: 凌云子 时间: 2008-12-16 00:45
[ 本帖最后由 凌云子 于 2008-12-16 03:18 编辑 ]
作者: 凌云子 时间: 2008-12-16 01:23
标题: 更正
不好意思
[ 本帖最后由 凌云子 于 2008-12-16 03:19 编辑 ]
作者: 不老松 时间: 2008-12-18 16:30
标题: 抛砖引玉
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[DhtmlXQ_title]征答悬赏贴：星星之火[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_type]残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_result]未知[/DhtmlXQ_result]
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[ 本帖最后由 不老松 于 2008-12-19 16:13 编辑 ]
作者: 87878787 时间: 2008-12-22 09:02
我认为本局不能成立！！！结果为黑胜！！！
作者: 87878787 时间: 2008-12-22 09:20
这能得奖吗？ 红先黑胜；试解如下；
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[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/viewthread.php%3Ftid%3D21029%26pid%3D136629%26page%3D1%26extra%3Dpage%253D2%23pid136629[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
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作者: 87878787 时间: 2008-12-22 09:35
上图的着法还有一些小变化。我想其他详尽着法个位朋友都以成竹在胸。
作者: 凌云子 时间: 2008-12-22 12:21
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[DhtmlXQ_title]征答悬赏贴：星星之火[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_type]残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_result]未知[/DhtmlXQ_result]
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作者: 不老松 时间: 2008-12-24 11:30
原帖由 87878787 于 2008-12-22 09:35 发表 
上图的着法还有一些小变化。我想其他详尽着法个位朋友都以成竹在胸。
作者: yjr123 时间: 2008-12-24 12:23
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[DhtmlXQ_title]征答悬赏贴：星星之火[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_type]残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_result]未知[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]7646423246423231797141624241313241405241717657587636625040504150363038394939324286850304858404058474051565475041[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
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[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/thread-21029-1-1.html[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
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作者: 凌云子 时间: 2008-12-24 17:44
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[DhtmlXQ_comment0]凌云子应答||||||||【征答悬赏贴】星星之火：结论红先黑胜。||||||正局着法详演如下：||（如图，红先黑胜）[/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
[DhtmlXQ_comment18]黑另有三种着法均和，详见附局。[/DhtmlXQ_comment18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment52]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment52]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_48]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_48]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_46]黑胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_46]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_42]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_42]
[DhtmlXQ_comment4_48]黑胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_48]
[DhtmlXQ_comment5_44]黑胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_44]
[DhtmlXQ_comment6_46]黑胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment6_46]
[DhtmlXQ_comment7_46]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment7_46]
[DhtmlXQ_comment8_30]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment8_30]
[DhtmlXQ_comment9_48]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment9_48]
[DhtmlXQ_comment10_46]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment10_46]
[DhtmlXQ_comment11_48]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment11_48]
[DhtmlXQ_comment12_48]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment12_48]
[DhtmlXQ_comment13_52]黑胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment13_52]
[DhtmlXQ_comment14_46]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment14_46]
[DhtmlXQ_comment15_28]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment15_28]
[DhtmlXQ_comment16_18]详见附局。[/DhtmlXQ_comment16_18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment17_18]详见附局。[/DhtmlXQ_comment17_18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment18_18]详见附局。[/DhtmlXQ_comment18_18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment19_24]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment19_24]
[DhtmlXQ_comment20_22]黑胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment20_22]
[DhtmlXQ_comment21_30]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment21_30]
[DhtmlXQ_comment22_28]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment22_28]
[DhtmlXQ_comment23_30]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment23_30]
[DhtmlXQ_comment24_14]与主变第6回合黑先退马殊途同归，着法请见变演示略。[/DhtmlXQ_comment24_14]
[DhtmlXQ_comment25_18]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment25_18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment26_63]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment26_63]
[DhtmlXQ_comment27_57]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment27_57]
[DhtmlXQ_comment28_47]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment28_47]
[DhtmlXQ_comment29_55]红胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment29_55]
[DhtmlXQ_comment30_53]红胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment30_53]
[DhtmlXQ_comment31_35]红胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment31_35]
[DhtmlXQ_comment32_43]红胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment32_43]
[DhtmlXQ_comment33_27]红胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment33_27]
[DhtmlXQ_comment34_22]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment34_22]
[DhtmlXQ_comment35_24]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment35_24]
[DhtmlXQ_comment36_24]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment36_24]
[DhtmlXQ_comment37_24]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment37_24]
[DhtmlXQ_comment38_14]形成黑必胜局面，着法略。[/DhtmlXQ_comment38_14]
[DhtmlXQ_comment39_14]形成黑必胜局势，着法略。[/DhtmlXQ_comment39_14]
[DhtmlXQ_comment40_18]黑胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment40_18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment41_24]黑胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment41_24]
[DhtmlXQ_comment42_18]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment42_18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment43_20]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment43_20]
[DhtmlXQ_comment44_28]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment44_28]
[DhtmlXQ_comment45_26]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment45_26]
[DhtmlXQ_comment46_28]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment46_28]
[DhtmlXQ_comment47_28]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment47_28]
[DhtmlXQ_comment48_20]黑胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment48_20]
[DhtmlXQ_comment49_26]黑胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment49_26]
[DhtmlXQ_comment50_26]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment50_26]
[DhtmlXQ_comment51_28]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment51_28]
[DhtmlXQ_comment52_28]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment52_28]
[DhtmlXQ_comment53_26]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment53_26]
[DhtmlXQ_comment54_24]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment54_24]
[DhtmlXQ_comment55_28]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment55_28]
[DhtmlXQ_comment56_24]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment56_24]
[DhtmlXQ_comment57_22]黑胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment57_22]
[DhtmlXQ_comment58_32]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment58_32]
[DhtmlXQ_open]A00 非常见开局[/DhtmlXQ_open]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.zychess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.zychess.com/bbs/viewthread.php%3Ftid%3D49127%26pid%3D298672%26page%3D2%26extra%3Dpage%253D1[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]
作者: wolaikk 时间: 2008-12-24 19:18
原帖由 87878787 于 2008-12-22 09:02 发表
我认为本局不能成立！！！结果为黑胜！！！
作者: 不老松 时间: 2008-12-25 10:28
标题: 另有和法
[DhtmlXQ]
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[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]7699655949999999999979999999998699419930425299994046993899370357[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_title]征答悬赏贴：星星之火[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_type]残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_result]未知[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]764642324642323179714162424131324140524171765758763662504050415036303839493932428685030485840405847405157464152564542526544426273949272830353738354542324535324235454232443432423444423245353242[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
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[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]
作者: wolaikk 时间: 2008-12-25 10:57
原帖由 不老松 于 2008-12-25 10:28 发表
www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
7699655949999999999979999999998699419930425299994046993899370357[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
征答悬赏贴：星星之火[/DhtmlXQ_title]
残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
未知[/DhtmlXQ ...
作者: wolaikk 时间: 2008-12-25 12:52
[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999655939999999999930999999998699999999425099999999999999370358[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_title]征答悬赏贴：星星之火[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_type]残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_result]未知[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]868558596547424185840304847404053033051574644131476915256454252654442627443431416947374733434748434727283444415144542829[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
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[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]
软件着法
作者: 不老松 时间: 2008-12-26 17:29
标题: 再抛一砖
[DhtmlXQ]
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[DhtmlXQ_binit]7699655949999999997999859999999940419930425299999946990337573899[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_title]星星之火[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_type]残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_result]未知[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]76464232464232317971416242413132414052417176575876366250405041503630383949393242654750413033374739490304858404058474051574641525645425263353586854442636534336375948685848374737443442324346324242524656[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/thread-21029-1-1.html[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]
作者: 凌云子 时间: 2008-12-26 18:29
见11楼主变。
作者: yjr123 时间: 2008-12-26 18:34
没有细看，但和11楼相比，发现第12回合黑方主动变着，才导致红方幸和，黑方如将卒４平５吃相改为卒６进１吃士，则黑方可胜。
作者: 凌云子 时间: 2008-12-26 20:31
我也没有细看，16楼边兵前进了一步 。
作者: 87878787 时间: 2008-12-28 15:06
原帖由 87878787 于 2008-12-22 09:02 发表
我认为本局不能成立！！！结果为黑胜！！！
作者: 87878787 时间: 2008-12-28 15:21
[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999655939999999999930999999994499999999425099999999999999371758[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_title]征答悬赏贴：星星之火[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_type]残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_result]未知[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]5859300017180009181965471909443409193444423244345041[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/viewthread.php%3Ftid%3D21029%26pid%3D137140%26page%3D1%26extra%3Dpage%253D1[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]
图（1）
[ 本帖最后由 87878787 于 2008-12-28 15:24 编辑 ]
作者: 87878787 时间: 2008-12-28 15:28
[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999475939999999999930999999995499999999425099999999999999371758[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_title]征答悬赏贴：星星之火[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_type]残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_result]未知[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]1718394937385444182844344252[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/viewthread.php%3Ftid%3D21029%26page%3D1%26extra%3Dpage%253D1%23pid137143[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
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（图2）在此以前红相三退五黑边卒抢先成杀！！！黑胜。
[ 本帖最后由 87878787 于 2008-12-28 15:40 编辑 ]
作者: 87878787 时间: 2008-12-28 15:33
[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999655939999999999933999999995499999999425099999999999999371758[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_title]征答悬赏贴：星星之火[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_type]残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_result]未知[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]1718335318286547373839492829[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/viewthread.php%3Ftid%3D21029%26pid%3D137144%26page%3D1%26extra%3Dpage%253D1%23pid137144[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]
图（3）
作者: yjr123 时间: 2008-12-28 18:38
呵呵，在这里贴得再详尽也不能得奖。
作者: 87878787 时间: 2008-12-29 14:58
标题: 黑胜
[难以祥尽。
[ 本帖最后由 87878787 于 2008-12-29 15:01 编辑 ]
作者: 凌云子 时间: 2008-12-29 19:03
原帖由 87878787 于 2008-12-29 14:58 发表
[难以祥尽。
作者: 凌云子 时间: 2008-12-29 19:16
要把复杂的东西变简单，就是使红方没有过多的选择，红方的变化减少了，也容易使局部或全部局面得出结论。此征答题的特殊是红先黑胜。从理论讲只要证明此局红先黑胜就应该算完成任务。
作者: 凌云子 时间: 2008-12-29 19:43
[DhtmlXQ] [DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver] [DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init] [DhtmlXQ_binit]7699655949999999999979999999998699419930425299994046993899370357[/DhtmlXQ_binit] [DhtmlXQ_title]征答悬赏贴：星星之火[/DhtmlXQ_title] [DhtmlXQ_type]残局[/DhtmlXQ_type] [DhtmlXQ_result]未知[/DhtmlXQ_result] [DhtmlXQ_movelist]764642324642323179714162424131324140524171765758763662504050415036303839493932428685030485840405847405157464151664541617[/DhtmlXQ_movelist] [DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/viewthread.php%3Ftid%3D21029%26pid%3D137238%26page%3D1%26extra%3Dpage%253D1%23pid137238[/DhtmlXQ_refer] [DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator] [/DhtmlXQ]
这是您的着法
第11回合红走兵一进一，黑走卒6进1迅速使局面定型并简化。
而选择卒1进1，
如图演示第12回合是走兵一进一，而此局的结论是黑胜，
为了得出黑胜的结论就必须炮六平七炮六平八炮六平九炮六退三炮六退五，相三进五等等。
同样第13回合时是走兵一进一，而此局的结论是黑胜，
为了得出黑胜的结论还必须炮六平七炮六平八炮六平九炮六退三炮六退五，相三进五等等重复解释，
然而在第14回合，第15回合仍要重复解释。
作者: 凌云子 时间: 2008-12-29 23:40
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[DhtmlXQ_result]未知[/DhtmlXQ_result]
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[DhtmlXQ_comment0]凌云子应答||||||||【征答悬赏贴】星星之火：结论红先黑胜。||||||正局着法详演如下：||（如图，红先黑胜）[/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
[DhtmlXQ_comment18]黑另有三种着法均和，详见附局。[/DhtmlXQ_comment18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment52]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment52]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_48]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_48]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_46]黑胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_46]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_42]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_42]
[DhtmlXQ_comment4_48]黑胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_48]
[DhtmlXQ_comment5_44]黑胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_44]
[DhtmlXQ_comment6_46]黑胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment6_46]
[DhtmlXQ_comment7_46]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment7_46]
[DhtmlXQ_comment8_30]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment8_30]
[DhtmlXQ_comment9_48]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment9_48]
[DhtmlXQ_comment10_46]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment10_46]
[DhtmlXQ_comment11_48]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment11_48]
[DhtmlXQ_comment12_48]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment12_48]
[DhtmlXQ_comment13_52]黑胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment13_52]
[DhtmlXQ_comment14_46]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment14_46]
[DhtmlXQ_comment15_28]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment15_28]
[DhtmlXQ_comment16_18]详见附局。[/DhtmlXQ_comment16_18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment17_18]详见附局。[/DhtmlXQ_comment17_18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment18_18]详见附局。[/DhtmlXQ_comment18_18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment19_24]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment19_24]
[DhtmlXQ_comment20_22]黑胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment20_22]
[DhtmlXQ_comment21_30]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment21_30]
[DhtmlXQ_comment22_28]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment22_28]
[DhtmlXQ_comment23_30]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment23_30]
[DhtmlXQ_comment24_14]与主变第6回合黑先退马殊途同归，着法请见变演示略。[/DhtmlXQ_comment24_14]
[DhtmlXQ_comment25_18]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment25_18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment26_63]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment26_63]
[DhtmlXQ_comment27_57]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment27_57]
[DhtmlXQ_comment28_47]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment28_47]
[DhtmlXQ_comment29_55]红胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment29_55]
[DhtmlXQ_comment30_53]红胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment30_53]
[DhtmlXQ_comment31_35]红胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment31_35]
[DhtmlXQ_comment32_43]红胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment32_43]
[DhtmlXQ_comment33_27]红胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment33_27]
[DhtmlXQ_comment35_24]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment35_24]
[DhtmlXQ_comment36_24]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment36_24]
[DhtmlXQ_comment37_24]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment37_24]
[DhtmlXQ_comment38_14]形成黑必胜局面，着法略。[/DhtmlXQ_comment38_14]
[DhtmlXQ_comment39_14]形成黑必胜局势，着法略。[/DhtmlXQ_comment39_14]
[DhtmlXQ_comment40_18]黑胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment40_18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment41_24]黑胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment41_24]
[DhtmlXQ_comment42_18]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment42_18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment43_20]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment43_20]
[DhtmlXQ_comment44_28]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment44_28]
[DhtmlXQ_comment45_26]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment45_26]
[DhtmlXQ_comment46_28]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment46_28]
[DhtmlXQ_comment47_28]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment47_28]
[DhtmlXQ_comment48_20]黑胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment48_20]
[DhtmlXQ_comment49_26]黑胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment49_26]
[DhtmlXQ_comment50_26]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment50_26]
[DhtmlXQ_comment51_28]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment51_28]
[DhtmlXQ_comment52_28]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment52_28]
[DhtmlXQ_comment53_26]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment53_26]
[DhtmlXQ_comment54_24]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment54_24]
[DhtmlXQ_comment55_28]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment55_28]
[DhtmlXQ_comment56_24]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment56_24]
[DhtmlXQ_comment57_22]黑胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment57_22]
[DhtmlXQ_comment58_32]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment58_32]
[DhtmlXQ_open]A00 非常见开局[/DhtmlXQ_open]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_21_8]3000585965475041868542320030413085843738[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_21_8]
[DhtmlXQ_move_59_25_60]3035423285843747393803048474040574640515645415253533252654442627443427283839474833432829[/DhtmlXQ_move_59_25_60][DhtmlXQ_comment60_46]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment60_46]
[DhtmlXQ_move_60_27_61]472903048584040584740515290715167464162664542627544427284434324235453738[/DhtmlXQ_move_60_27_61][DhtmlXQ_comment61_44]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment61_44]
[DhtmlXQ_move_59_27_63]472903048584040584740515746415256454252654442627443432423337594939382728[/DhtmlXQ_move_59_27_63][DhtmlXQ_move_59_27_62]4765030485840405847405157464151664541626544426274434324265473747334327283444473743332829[/DhtmlXQ_move_59_27_62][DhtmlXQ_comment62_48]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment62_48]
[DhtmlXQ_comment63_44]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment63_44][DhtmlXQ_comment59_46]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment59_46][DhtmlXQ_comment34_30]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment34_30]
[DhtmlXQ_move_34_20_64]38394939585978714150222131322128462771773738[/DhtmlXQ_move_34_20_64][DhtmlXQ_comment64_30]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment64_30]
[DhtmlXQ_move_34_17_65]707141506261313261215758212232312229466759485848[/DhtmlXQ_move_34_17_65][DhtmlXQ_comment66_26]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment66_26]
[DhtmlXQ_move_65_19_66]71775758777838394939585962223738[/DhtmlXQ_move_65_19_66][DhtmlXQ_comment65_28]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment65_28]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hychess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hychess.com/bbs/viewthread.php%3Ftid%3D7205%26extra%3Dpage%253D1%26page%3D6[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]
作者: 87878787 时间: 2008-12-30 09:48
注意；由于本局是黑胜局。本局黑要速胜。红要迟负。
作者: 凌云子 时间: 2008-12-30 12:26
原帖由 87878787 于 2008-12-30 09:48 发表
注意；由于本局是黑胜局。本局黑要速胜。红要迟负。
:P :P
请您详尽的列出上面的所有变化，才确定------黑方不上士而急进卒能速胜。
用具体的着法来证明您的推测！
作者: 87878787 时间: 2008-12-30 17:00
标题: 相退五红速败!!! 例1
[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999995939994799999930999999998699999999425099999999993703999958[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_result]未知[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_open]A00 非常见开局[/DhtmlXQ_open]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]0304394904055948374748590506[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/thread-21029-2-1.html[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]
作者: 87878787 时间: 2008-12-30 17:05
标题: 相退五红速败!!! 例2
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[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999995939994799999930999999998699999999425099999999993703999958[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_result]未知[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_open]A00 非常见开局[/DhtmlXQ_open]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]03048685040585840506847406077464071764541718544418284434283839494252[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/viewthread.php%3Ftid%3D21029%26pid%3D137270%26page%3D2%26extra%3Dpage%253D1%23pid137270[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]
作者: 87878787 时间: 2008-12-30 17:15
标题: 另外您黑士6进5的攻法我认为不严厉.黑直进边卒严厉!!!
红进边兵并非简化!!!是黑方不可避免的变化.另外您黑士6进5的攻法我认为不严厉..黑直进边卒严厉!!!
[ 本帖最后由 87878787 于 2008-12-30 17:17 编辑 ]
作者: 凌云子 时间: 2008-12-30 18:58
原帖由 87878787 于 2008-12-30 17:15 发表
红进边兵并非简化!!!是黑方不可避免的变化.另外您黑士6进5的攻法我认为不严厉..黑直进边卒严厉!!!
作者: yjr123 时间: 2008-12-30 21:23
原帖由 87878787 于 2008-12-30 17:15 发表 红进边兵并非简化!!!是黑方不可避免的变化.另外您黑士6进5的攻法我认为不严厉..黑直进边卒严厉!!!
[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
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[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999995949996599769979999999998640999930425299419999463703389957[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_result]未知[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]76464232464232317971416242413132414052417176625076365758405041503630383949393242654703048685040585840506847406073949071730351727354537477464273764543738544442524454[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_move_2_31_1]746437473938051564541525544425264434262733432737383947483433323143464838[/DhtmlXQ_move_2_31_1]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_21_59]86855859654750413033423285843747393803048474040574640515645415255444252644342627337327283839474873784849[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_21_59]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_52]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_52]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_48]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_48]
[DhtmlXQ_open]A00 非常见开局[/DhtmlXQ_open]
[DhtmlXQ_comment59_46]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment59_46]
[DhtmlXQ_comment0]凌云子应答[/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_22_2]5041303358598685030485840405847442324729051574641516645416175444172744343242294737473444474844434232434232314241313233345949[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_22_2]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]mk%3A///%0D%0Amk%3A@MSITStore%3AD%3A%5C%u68CB%u8C31%u8F6C%u6362%u5668.chm%3A%3A/index.htm[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
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作者: 87878787 时间: 2008-12-31 09:16
标题: 回123
原帖由 凌云子 于 2008-12-30 18:58 发表
建议你好好研究！
作者: 87878787 时间: 2008-12-31 09:46
标题: 回凌云子先生；
1）您提出红直进兵后相三退五要反复的解我认为没有必要。只要您提出一路基本速败即可，
2）您提出红直进兵是简单的定位。我认为是在繁杂的变化提炼而成。是黑方不可避免的变化。
关于详尽；假如把棋局解和或解错。解的再详尽也是错的。您说呢。
3）您建议我（（建议你好好研究！））共勉把！
4）解排局谁都可能犯错。共勉把！！！
作者: yjr123 时间: 2008-12-31 10:37
[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999995949994799999945999999997499999999425099999999993727999958[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_result]未知[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_open]A00 非常见开局[/DhtmlXQ_open]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]37384725[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_2_1]746442325948272864542829[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_2_1][DhtmlXQ_comment2]和[/DhtmlXQ_comment2]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/thread-21029-2-1.html[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]
作者: yjr123 时间: 2008-12-31 10:40
凌云子的着法是尽快定形，让红方无可变化，应是正解。
作者: 凌云子 时间: 2008-12-31 11:16
[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999995939994799999930999999998699999999425099999999993703999958[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_result]未知[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_open]A00 非常见开局[/DhtmlXQ_open]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]03043949040586853747[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_4_1]5948374748590506[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_4_1]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/thread-21029-2-1.html[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
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殊途同归，见下图第9着！
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[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999995949996599999930999999998699999950329999999999993803589937[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_result]未知[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]384859483242654737474859030486850405858405158474152574642535645435365444363730003738000838485948584849594757081842324434324234444252445448585949574718085242544442324434584849594757081832423444[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_20_1]303537383545423244345041454658594959475759493242344442324636574736463231443441503433314133434151435351415343415143535141[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_20_1]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_14_2]30384748594858484959483859583848585725357464354557474838473738286454454654444241444341404342504142414041[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_14_2]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_14_3]30342535746435366454363754443738340442524454524254444232443458594959384804084757[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_14_3]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_7_4]58594959474886850304858404058474051574641525645425353040423254443242443442324043353634444838595850415857[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_7_4]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_7_5]4232868503048584040584740515746415256454252630002627544427370008585949593738443438480818475718083242344442324434485859495747081832423444584849594757[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_7_5]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_6_6]304058484959423240484748[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_6_6]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_6_7]48394252394858484939473730353738[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_6_7]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_6_8]48374232868532313010473710163747163647484939585985845949[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_6_8]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_4_9]304037388685424185844140847438484939585974645949[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_4_9]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_2_10]493937383038483839493839[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_2_10]
[DhtmlXQ_comment0]凌云子应答||||附局-------||||即正局第9回合黑方改走前卒平的变化。||||着法详演如下：||||（如图，红先和）[/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
[DhtmlXQ_comment48]和[/DhtmlXQ_comment48]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_49]和[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_49]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_39]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_39]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_33]和[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_33]
[DhtmlXQ_comment4_32]和[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_32]
[DhtmlXQ_comment5_43]和[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_43]
[DhtmlXQ_comment6_11]黑胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment6_11]
[DhtmlXQ_comment7_13]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment7_13]
[DhtmlXQ_comment8_19]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment8_19]
[DhtmlXQ_comment9_15]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment9_15]
[DhtmlXQ_comment10_7]黑胜[/DhtmlXQ_comment10_7]
[DhtmlXQ_open]A00 非常见开局[/DhtmlXQ_open]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hychess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hychess.com/bbs/viewthread.php%3Ftid%3D7205%26extra%3D%26page%3D6[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]
作者: 87878787 时间: 2008-12-31 11:58
原帖由 yjr123 于 2008-12-30 21:23 发表
www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]9999995949996599769979999999998640999930425299419999463703389957[/DhtmlXQ_binit]未知[/DhtmlXQ_result]7646423246423231797141624241313241405241717 ...
作者: 凌云子 时间: 2008-12-31 12:25
原帖由 87878787 于 2008-12-31 11:58 发表
yjr123先生第16回退炮能解进卒的杀法。我看了很多变化就没看这路变化。惭愧！！！
作者: yjr123 时间: 2008-12-31 13:05
原帖由 凌云子 于 2008-12-31 12:25 发表 这路变化已经出现过，只你没有注意。见上面的9楼，10楼，13楼
应该在这3个贴中没有这路变化。
作者: yjr123 时间: 2008-12-31 13:09
原帖由 87878787 于 2008-12-31 11:58 发表 yjr123先生第16回退炮能解进卒的杀法。我看了很多变化就没看这路变化。惭愧！！！
进卒杀法应该也是成立的，只不过还是要靠上士才能取胜，见我10楼着法。
先上士定形可减少红方变化，是比较好的策略。
作者: 87878787 时间: 2008-12-31 13:57
标题: 还有一个问题；下面是我在早提出的一路胜法。
见下图谁先变着呢？如红变着则黑速胜成立，如何判呢？？？
[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
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[DhtmlXQ_binit]7699655949999999999979999999998699419930425299994046993899370357[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_title]征答悬赏贴：星星之火[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_type]残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_result]未知[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]76464232464232317971416242413132414052417176575876366250405041503630383949393242868503048584040584740515746415166454161754445859303317276547272844342838[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/thread-21029-1-1.html[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]
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[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999479939999999999930999999997499999999425099999999999999371559[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_title]征答悬赏贴：星星之火[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_type]残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_result]未知[/DhtmlXQ_result]
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[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/thread-21029-1-1.html[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
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作者: yjr123 时间: 2008-12-31 15:26
下图双方不变作和
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