奥林匹克马术大赛（红先胜）2015年第3期《棋友》

yjr123 发表于 2022-3-1 07:47:46

chouzhouyu 发表于 2022-2-28 22:19

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[DhtmlXQ_title]奥林匹克马术大赛[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_result]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_result]
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[DhtmlXQ_comment1_25]至此脱帽。||以下马术大赛。[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_25]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_67]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_67]
[DhtmlXQ_type]实战中残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
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yjr123 发表于 2022-3-3 13:24:35

聨吟客发表于 2022-3-3 11:18
想到
裘朢禹少子百局譜

在没有云库和棋软的年代，这种残局难度很高，实战基本都是错进错出，排局谱也不例外。
这4局云库显示都是和棋，应该也不会有棋规问题。

聨吟客 发表于 2022-3-2 07:15:24

本帖最后由聨吟客于 2022-3-2 07:51 编辑

奇蹟三號发表于 2022-3-1 20:59
這樣紅幾回合勝?
13. 炮八平五炮５进３ 14. 帅五退一马３进５馬回中路
15. 帅五进一马５退３ ...

14樓12回合是走進士

13回合以後參看云庫有勝法
用兵換炮型成例勝局面

只是具體走法尚須很多回合
不知有效步數怎麼算?

聨吟客 发表于 2022-2-27 01:50:30

還有
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聨吟客 发表于 2022-3-5 10:52:36

17樓精簡圖著
就無那些煩人的支變
呵呵呵

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聨吟客 发表于 2022-3-5 10:27:11

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[DhtmlXQ_comment0]超難殘局||||資料來自各位||yjr123||聨吟客||玄机逸士||chouzhouyu||奇蹟三號[/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
[DhtmlXQ_comment15]正確走炮九平八[/DhtmlXQ_comment15]
[DhtmlXQ_comment13_30]馬術大賽[/DhtmlXQ_comment13_30]
[DhtmlXQ_comment13_63]胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment13_63]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_15]脫帽欣賞馬術[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_15]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_18]脫帽欣賞馬術[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_25]脫帽欣賞馬術[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_25]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_67]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_67]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_18]这样还能赛马吗？[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment8_23]红胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment8_23]
[DhtmlXQ_comment9_23]红得子胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment9_23]
[DhtmlXQ_comment10_23]红得子胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment10_23]
[DhtmlXQ_comment11_9]红得子胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment11_9]
[DhtmlXQ_type]实战中残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_owner]各位大師[/DhtmlXQ_owner]
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[DhtmlXQ_comment14_25]2种着法到底哪个比较好？实战似乎此着比较容易控制。[/DhtmlXQ_comment14_25]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_24_14]43464858[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_24_14][DhtmlXQ_comment28]紅勝定||但具體走法還須很多回合||||有效步數如何計算||到此為止嗎||還是要將死||還是要破一士才算呢[/DhtmlXQ_comment28]
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聨吟客 发表于 2022-3-5 10:12:42

yjr123 发表于 2022-3-5 08:58

那就是13樓走法是嗎

牽涉到黑方怎走才算遲負的有效步數計算

例如12回合士5進6

yjr123 发表于 2022-3-5 08:58:31

奇蹟三號发表于 2022-3-3 13:19

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[DhtmlXQ_result]红胜[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_remark]各位大師[/DhtmlXQ_remark]
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[DhtmlXQ_comment0]超難殘局||||資料來自各位||yjr123||聨吟客||玄机逸士||chouzhouyu||奇蹟三號[/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
[DhtmlXQ_comment15]正確走炮九平八[/DhtmlXQ_comment15]
[DhtmlXQ_comment13_30]馬術大賽[/DhtmlXQ_comment13_30]
[DhtmlXQ_comment13_63]胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment13_63]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_15]脫帽欣賞馬術[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_15]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_18]脫帽欣賞馬術[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_25]脫帽欣賞馬術[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_25]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_67]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_67]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_18]这样还能赛马吗？[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment8_23]红胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment8_23]
[DhtmlXQ_comment9_23]红得子胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment9_23]
[DhtmlXQ_comment10_23]红得子胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment10_23]
[DhtmlXQ_comment11_9]红得子胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment11_9]
[DhtmlXQ_type]实战中残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_owner]各位大師[/DhtmlXQ_owner]
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聨吟客 发表于 2022-3-3 15:19:56

yjr123 发表于 2022-3-3 13:24
在没有云库和棋软的年代，这种残局难度很高，实战基本都是错进错出，排局谱也不例外。
这4局云库显示都 ...

哇口圭

這四局裘老都錯喔

呵呵真是不簡單

我忘了我有無用云庫玩這四局還是其中兩局

再找時間去學習學習

奇蹟三號 发表于 2022-3-3 13:19:36

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[DhtmlXQ_comment0]超難殘局||||資料來自各位||yjr123||聨吟客||玄机逸士||chouzhouyu||奇蹟三號[/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
[DhtmlXQ_comment15]正確走炮九平八[/DhtmlXQ_comment15]
[DhtmlXQ_comment30]馬術大賽[/DhtmlXQ_comment30]
[DhtmlXQ_comment63]胜定[/DhtmlXQ_comment63]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_15]脫帽欣賞馬術[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_15]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_18]脫帽欣賞馬術[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_25]脫帽欣賞馬術[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_25]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_67]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_67]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_18]这样还能赛马吗？[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment8_23]红胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment8_23]
[DhtmlXQ_comment9_23]红得子胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment9_23]
[DhtmlXQ_comment10_23]红得子胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment10_23]
[DhtmlXQ_comment11_9]红得子胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment11_9]
[DhtmlXQ_type]实战中残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
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聨吟客 发表于 2022-3-3 11:24:24

17樓可命名雙仕(士)賽馬

呵呵呵呵呵呵呵呵呵呵呵呵呵呵..........................................................

聨吟客 发表于 2022-3-3 11:18:01

想到
裘朢禹少子百局譜

第7局底象賽馬
第8局高象賽馬
第9局單象賽馬
第10局草原賽馬

第7與8局以前好像有討論
原譜是否有問題呵呵

聨吟客 发表于 2022-3-3 11:07:13

呵呵呵

所以我喜歡以17樓作為初始局面

不失為佳局

就紅馬路線而言
比泥馬渡康王類局的紅勝局更曲折

yjr123 发表于 2022-3-3 09:32:26

如果9楼是原征答揭晓的答案，那么第8回合红走得不精确，12回合和9楼11回合相比，就炮差一格，应该对局势没有影响。那么黑方如何最顽强？红方能否保持赛马的意图呢？
赛马只是其中一种胜法，而且是最容易出错的胜法。

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奇蹟三號 发表于 2022-3-2 21:49:30

  1. 马九进七  炮３平４ 2. 帅五进一  炮４平３
  3. 帅五进一  炮３平４ 4. 仕六进五  炮４平３
  5. 仕五进六

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[DhtmlXQ_comment34]！！！[/DhtmlXQ_comment34]
[DhtmlXQ_comment52]黑长将必须变招！[/DhtmlXQ_comment52]
[DhtmlXQ_comment71]红胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment71]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_77]红胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_77]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_49]红胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_49]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_49]红得子胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_49]
[DhtmlXQ_comment9_52]黑长将必须变招！[/DhtmlXQ_comment9_52]
[DhtmlXQ_comment10_15]脱帽||马术大赛[/DhtmlXQ_comment10_15]
[DhtmlXQ_comment10_18]这样还能赛马吗？[/DhtmlXQ_comment10_18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment11_18]脱帽||马术大赛[/DhtmlXQ_comment11_18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment11_25]至此脱帽。||以下马术大赛。[/DhtmlXQ_comment11_25]
[DhtmlXQ_comment11_67]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment11_67]
[DhtmlXQ_comment17_35]||合并来源：||标题：超难残局D变||赛事：||日期：||红方：||黑方：||结果：未知||方式：[/DhtmlXQ_comment17_35]
[DhtmlXQ_comment36_23]红胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment36_23]
[DhtmlXQ_comment37_23]红得子胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment37_23]
[DhtmlXQ_comment38_23]红得子胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment38_23]
[DhtmlXQ_comment39_9]红得子胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment39_9]
[DhtmlXQ_type]实战中残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
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奇蹟三號 发表于 2022-3-2 21:43:45

yjr123多謝你的寶貴意見，紅方第四回合
走仕四進五看來有些不行，要改用仕六進五。

yjr123 发表于 2022-3-2 20:48:45

奇蹟三號发表于 2022-3-2 20:19
請提出寶貴意見

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[DhtmlXQ_comment5_35]||合并来源：||标题：超难残局D变||赛事：||日期：||红方：||黑方：||结果：未知||方式：[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_35]
[DhtmlXQ_comment23_34]！！！[/DhtmlXQ_comment23_34]
[DhtmlXQ_comment23_52]黑长将必须变招！[/DhtmlXQ_comment23_52]
[DhtmlXQ_comment23_71]红胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment23_71]
[DhtmlXQ_comment24_77]红胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment24_77]
[DhtmlXQ_comment25_49]红胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment25_49]
[DhtmlXQ_comment26_49]红得子胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment26_49]
[DhtmlXQ_comment32_52]黑长将必须变招！[/DhtmlXQ_comment32_52]
[DhtmlXQ_comment33_15]脱帽||马术大赛[/DhtmlXQ_comment33_15]
[DhtmlXQ_comment33_18]这样还能赛马吗？[/DhtmlXQ_comment33_18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment34_18]脱帽||马术大赛[/DhtmlXQ_comment34_18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment34_25]至此脱帽。||以下马术大赛。[/DhtmlXQ_comment34_25]
[DhtmlXQ_comment34_67]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment34_67]
[DhtmlXQ_comment36_23]红胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment36_23]
[DhtmlXQ_comment37_23]红得子胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment37_23]
[DhtmlXQ_comment38_23]红得子胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment38_23]
[DhtmlXQ_comment39_9]红得子胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment39_9]
[DhtmlXQ_type]实战中残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_owner]各位大師[/DhtmlXQ_owner]
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[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

奇蹟三號 发表于 2022-3-2 20:19:13

請提出寶貴意見
[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_title]超時代奧林匹克馬術大賽紅先勝[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_event][/DhtmlXQ_event]
[DhtmlXQ_date][/DhtmlXQ_date]
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[DhtmlXQ_comment5_35]||合并来源：||标题：超难残局D变||赛事：||日期：||红方：||黑方：||结果：未知||方式：[/DhtmlXQ_comment5_35]
[DhtmlXQ_comment23_34]！！！[/DhtmlXQ_comment23_34]
[DhtmlXQ_comment23_52]黑长将必须变招！[/DhtmlXQ_comment23_52]
[DhtmlXQ_comment23_71]红胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment23_71]
[DhtmlXQ_comment24_77]红胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment24_77]
[DhtmlXQ_comment25_49]红胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment25_49]
[DhtmlXQ_comment26_49]红得子胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment26_49]
[DhtmlXQ_comment32_52]黑长将必须变招！[/DhtmlXQ_comment32_52]
[DhtmlXQ_comment33_15]脱帽||马术大赛[/DhtmlXQ_comment33_15]
[DhtmlXQ_comment33_18]这样还能赛马吗？[/DhtmlXQ_comment33_18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment34_18]脱帽||马术大赛[/DhtmlXQ_comment34_18]
[DhtmlXQ_comment34_25]至此脱帽。||以下马术大赛。[/DhtmlXQ_comment34_25]
[DhtmlXQ_comment34_67]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment34_67]
[DhtmlXQ_comment36_23]红胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment36_23]
[DhtmlXQ_comment37_23]红得子胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment37_23]
[DhtmlXQ_comment38_23]红得子胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment38_23]
[DhtmlXQ_comment39_9]红得子胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment39_9]
[DhtmlXQ_type]实战中残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_timerule][/DhtmlXQ_timerule]
[DhtmlXQ_endtype][/DhtmlXQ_endtype]
[DhtmlXQ_owner]各位大師[/DhtmlXQ_owner]
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[DhtmlXQ_gametype][/DhtmlXQ_gametype]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.ccbridge.net[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

奇蹟三號 发表于 2022-3-2 15:52:40

好，知道，紅會勝。

奇蹟三號 发表于 2022-3-2 13:41:59

好，明白，知道，紅確認可勝。

yjr123 发表于 2022-3-2 09:46:10

奇蹟三號发表于 2022-3-2 09:23
兌炮的變化云庫也有勝法

以下是云库链接，可在左边选择自动走红，你执黑在棋盘上走。

http://www.chessdb.cn/query/?2N2k3/2n1P4/5a3/9/9/9/9/3A5/4A4/5K3%20b

奇蹟三號 发表于 2022-3-2 09:42:58

紅會勝嗎?
[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_title]超時代奧林匹克馬術大賽紅先[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_event][/DhtmlXQ_event]
[DhtmlXQ_date][/DhtmlXQ_date]
[DhtmlXQ_place][/DhtmlXQ_place]
[DhtmlXQ_round][/DhtmlXQ_round]
[DhtmlXQ_table][/DhtmlXQ_table]
[DhtmlXQ_red][/DhtmlXQ_red]
[DhtmlXQ_redteam][/DhtmlXQ_redteam]
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[DhtmlXQ_blackrating][/DhtmlXQ_blackrating]
[DhtmlXQ_blacktime][/DhtmlXQ_time]
[DhtmlXQ_result]未知[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_remark]各位大師[/DhtmlXQ_remark]
[DhtmlXQ_author]各位大師[/DhtmlXQ_author]
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[DhtmlXQ_type]摆谱中残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
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[DhtmlXQ_endtype][/DhtmlXQ_endtype]
[DhtmlXQ_owner]各位大師[/DhtmlXQ_owner]
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[DhtmlXQ_gametype][/DhtmlXQ_gametype]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.ccbridge.net[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

奇蹟三號 发表于 2022-3-2 09:23:04

本帖最后由奇蹟三號于 2022-3-2 09:25 编辑

兌炮的變化云庫也有勝法
[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_title]超時代奧林匹克馬術大賽紅先[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_event][/DhtmlXQ_event]
[DhtmlXQ_date][/DhtmlXQ_date]
[DhtmlXQ_place][/DhtmlXQ_place]
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[DhtmlXQ_result]未知[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_remark]各位大師[/DhtmlXQ_remark]
[DhtmlXQ_author]各位大師[/DhtmlXQ_author]
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[DhtmlXQ_move_1_3_5]59192113191426221404[/DhtmlXQ_move_1_3_5]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_20]黑长将必须变招！[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_20]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_39]红胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_39]
[DhtmlXQ_comment2_45]红胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment2_45]
[DhtmlXQ_comment3_17]红胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment3_17]
[DhtmlXQ_comment4_17]红得子胜！[/DhtmlXQ_comment4_17]
[DhtmlXQ_type]摆谱中残局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
[DhtmlXQ_timerule][/DhtmlXQ_timerule]
[DhtmlXQ_endtype][/DhtmlXQ_endtype]
[DhtmlXQ_owner]各位大師[/DhtmlXQ_owner]
[DhtmlXQ_firstnum]0[/DhtmlXQ_firstnum]
[DhtmlXQ_gametype][/DhtmlXQ_gametype]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.ccbridge.net[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

走炮６进３

奇蹟三號 发表于 2022-3-2 09:03:21

[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_title]无标题[/DhtmlXQ_title]
[DhtmlXQ_event][/DhtmlXQ_event]
[DhtmlXQ_date][/DhtmlXQ_date]
[DhtmlXQ_place][/DhtmlXQ_place]
[DhtmlXQ_round][/DhtmlXQ_round]
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[DhtmlXQ_blacktime][/DhtmlXQ_time]
[DhtmlXQ_result]未知[/DhtmlXQ_result]
[DhtmlXQ_remark][/DhtmlXQ_remark]
[DhtmlXQ_author][/DhtmlXQ_author]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9920993748599999999999519999999999219930404199999949999999999999[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
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[DhtmlXQ_comment1]至此脱帽。||以下马术大赛。[/DhtmlXQ_comment1]
[DhtmlXQ_comment1_43]红胜。[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_43]
[DhtmlXQ_type]实战全局/开局[/DhtmlXQ_type]
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聨吟客 发表于 2022-3-2 08:55:26

奇蹟三號发表于 2022-3-2 08:29
14樓12回合是走進士

13回合以後參看云庫有勝法

兌炮的變化云庫也有勝法

奇蹟三號 发表于 2022-3-2 08:29:12

14樓12回合是走進士

13回合以後參看云庫有勝法
用兵換炮型成例勝局面

明白，知道，如果紅勝十二回合黑不應走士５进６
走炮５进３，炮５进３紅亦不能勝。

主變第十三回合此時可應走士５进６，這裡有分別。

聨吟客 发表于 2022-3-2 07:36:37

本帖最后由聨吟客于 2022-3-2 07:45 编辑

下圖這局黑方無士最後也能勝

只是各詮注本都沒有列出8回合以後具體走法
呵呵沒有勤快一點的編書者詮注者對此局8回合以後列出具體走法
他們可能覺得很容易?
實則著數不算少支變也瑣碎繁多
對於不是高手的普通愛好者而言研究起來很吃力痛苦
我也算是其中之一呵呵呵呵呵

還好現今可參看云庫學習

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聨吟客 发表于 2022-3-1 22:54:33

奇蹟三號发表于 2022-3-1 21:50
故而大部份答卷主
著法最後的勝法就會不盡相同，
其原因在於有的多“將軍”幾步，

喔

謝謝

關於例勝的定義有時也很頭痛
馬炮雙士對馬雙士ㄧ般說來是否例勝
看位置如何有的走起來步數還不少

又如17樓局面能不能算例勝
那有效步數就歸零了
呵呵呵呵呵

奇蹟三號 发表于 2022-3-1 21:50:48

故而大部份答卷主
著法最後的勝法就會不盡相同，
其原因在於有的多“將軍”幾步，
有的少“將軍”幾步。其實只要
是無謂的著法，例如毫無意義的
送吃、不起變化的反復“將軍”、
例勝時續弈至擒住黑將等等，都
不計算有效著數。

奇蹟三號 发表于 2022-3-1 21:48:11

十七回合
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聨吟客 发表于 2022-3-1 21:41:05

奇蹟三號发表于 2022-3-1 21:25
要釐清黑以遲負步數計算的標準是什麼
想要看當前局面或参看螞蟻大戰的釋弈

喔

他們怎麼說的

呵呵呵呵

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