请大师们根据着法，推定棋图！

老鸽子

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[DhtmlXQ_comment0]这是原局图、着，已经多次核对无误。图势近似：心谱-五虎争雄、百局-五虎下川、竹谱-大五虎(三局同图)。||||所列为全部着法，且无注解。从其着法来看，图势肯定有误，但不知该如何更正。[/DhtmlXQ_comment0][DhtmlXQ_comment43]至此结局，未标明胜、负、和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment43]
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老鸽子

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★星海★

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[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/forum.php%3Fmod%3Dviewthread%26tid%3D57382[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
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老鸽子

★星海★ 发表于 2023-3-26 00:29

红方若有中相，黑方应有八路底卒。

yjr123

老鸽子 发表于 2023-3-26 07:33
红方若有中相，黑方应有八路底卒。

八路底卒有什么用处？

★星海★

8路底卒的用处就是红要换一种胜法

★星海★

根据老鸽子的修改意见，加8路卒，再做适当调整可和
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凌云子

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[DhtmlXQ_comment1_43]至此结局，未标明胜、负、和。[/DhtmlXQ_comment1_43]
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桑莫喜

凌云子 发表于 2023-3-26 10:32

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[DhtmlXQ_comment0]棋图应是这样吧。[/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
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yjr123

如果原棋图错误，而着法也不正确，则要推测出原图，几乎不可能，也没有意义。

yjr123

桑莫喜 发表于 2023-3-26 13:00

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[DhtmlXQ_comment0]棋图应是这样吧。[/DhtmlXQ_comment0]
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桑莫喜

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yjr123

桑莫喜 发表于 2023-3-26 22:15

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老鸽子

yjr123 发表于 2023-3-27 10:26

谢谢诸位大师们诠正！标题局最大的不同是红相位置。

叶底三五（心谱-五霸尊周、五虎争雄、五将失道）类局，古谱中有十来局（包括同局），都是七路底相，唯有“百局-四寇擒王”是三路底相；现代有正式刊载的改局有二十余局，也仅有1局是三路底相，有些特别，所以我才关注，在这里帖出。

老鸽子

凌云子 发表于 2023-3-26 10:32

根据原谱图着，8楼、11楼推定的棋图都不错！我在这里想请教的就是三路底相版本所能带来的新变，谢谢！

凌云子

老鸽子 发表于 2023-3-27 15:52
根据原谱图着，8楼、11楼推定的棋图都不错！我在这里想请教的就是三路底相版本所能带来的新变，谢谢！

七路底相，黑有压相眼进中卒的可能，而三路底相，黑中卒几乎没有中路突破的可能。
而大五虎属于红优排局(红方主动稍优)，黑方本来就较被动。

如果黑中卒不起作用，红方优势更明显。

老鸽子

凌云子 发表于 2023-3-27 21:16
七路底相，黑有压相眼进中卒的可能，而三路底相，黑中卒几乎没有中路突破的可能。
而大五虎属于红优排局 ...

红方本就稍优，也难怪很少有人用三路底相改图！

本局因有三路底相限制黑方进中卒，故删去中卒可能不是漏刻，而是经过考虑的。但随之出现另一个问题：造成将帅露脸，黑方中马动弹不得，红方速胜。

古婺

图1中说“原局图、着，已经多次核对无误。”     但19回合卒在相眼，红走不了相七进九啊。

yjr123

古婺 发表于 2023-3-28 15:30
图1中说“原局图、着，已经多次核对无误。”     但19回合卒在相眼，红走不了相七进九啊。

意思就是和书上的棋图和着法多次核对，书上这么走，他就这么录。