[讨论]征西局大退车最新变化探讨

蛟川鱼 · 发表于 2008-7-31 20:37:00

[此贴子已经被作者于2008-7-31 21:22:00编辑过]

蛟川鱼 · 发表于 2008-7-31 20:44:00

蛟川鱼 · 发表于 2008-7-31 20:48:00

蛟川鱼 · 发表于 2008-7-31 20:54:00

蛟川鱼 · 发表于 2008-7-31 21:00:00

[此贴子已经被作者于2008-7-31 21:03:09编辑过]

蛟川鱼 · 发表于 2008-7-31 21:10:00

蛟川鱼 · 发表于 2008-8-2 09:48:00

[此贴子已经被作者于2008-8-2 10:14:48编辑过]

蛟川鱼 · 发表于 2008-8-2 13:12:00

蛟川鱼 · 发表于 2008-8-2 14:11:00

一招惊心 · 发表于 2008-8-2 20:36:00

5楼第四回和红车三退二？

蛟川鱼 · 发表于 2008-8-3 08:45:00

QUOTE:

以下是引用一招惊心在2008-8-2 20:36:00的发言：
5楼第四回和红车三退二？

这正是以后要讨论的二个主要变化的其中之一：

[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999999948994799579959999999999999999999429999993799109999999939[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]5979101279783736576712176769[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/post.asp%3Faction%3Dre%26BoardID%3D48%26replyID%3D133368%26ID%3D19907%26star%3D2%26reply%3Dtrue[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

之二：

[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999999948994799579959999999999999999999429999993799109999999939[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]59791012797837365750[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/post.asp%3Faction%3Dre%26BoardID%3D48%26replyID%3D133368%26ID%3D19907%26star%3D2%26reply%3Dtrue[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

蛟川鱼 · 发表于 2008-8-3 09:08:00

先来讨论之一的变化：

[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999999948994799699978999999999999999999429999993699179999999939[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]171969673929[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/dispbbs.asp%3Fboardid%3D48%26id%3D19907%26star%3D2%26page%3D1[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

至此，红有：一．帅五平四　　二．炮二平三　　三．炮二平一　四．车平四　五．车三进五　等多种着法．

蛟川鱼 · 发表于 2008-8-3 10:35:00

帅五平四的变化：

[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999999948994799679978999999999999999999429999993699199999999929[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]485836565848[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/dispbbs.asp%3FboardID%3D48%26ID%3D19907%26star%3D2%26page%3D1[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

上图结尾红如车三平四，就有：

[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999999948994799679978999999999999999999429999993699199999999929[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]485836566757566657524241472966685857687852537879534341314333314133434131432379595747594947573141232849462821414021514649[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/post.asp%3Faction%3Dre%26BoardID%3D48%26replyID%3D133400%26ID%3D19907%26star%3D2[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

蛟川鱼 · 发表于 2008-8-3 10:46:00

接着有：

[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999999948994799679978999999999999999999429999995699199999999929[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]567678777686778786268788267688682939[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_2_1]7858764648384636384819176762424162123637[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_2_1]
[DhtmlXQ_move_1_4_2]5878191767694647485847467877464858571777[/DhtmlXQ_move_1_4_2]
[DhtmlXQ_move_2_10_3]696242416252467678687666[/DhtmlXQ_move_2_10_3]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/dispbbs.asp%3Fboardid%3D48%26id%3D19907%26star%3D2%26page%3D1[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

蛟川鱼 · 发表于 2008-8-3 10:57:00

其中此处第二着的炮二平四不好，不管如何变化，黑要胜．此时红方只有炮二进一，或炮二平三．

[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999999948994799679978999999999999999999429999995699199999999929[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]5676785876464838463638481917676936466929464748384748383748462922424122321719[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/dispbbs.asp%3FboardID%3D48%26ID%3D19907%26star%3D2%26page%3D1[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

[此贴子已经被作者于2008-8-3 10:58:12编辑过]

蛟川鱼 · 发表于 2008-8-4 08:09:00

还是黑可胜:

[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999999948994799579959999999999999999999429999993799109999999939[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]5979101757673727797817184838187838397808394927264959265659495646495908076762424162524647[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_11_1]3938080738392737394937366762424162023637[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_11_1]
[DhtmlXQ_move_1_17_2]67683646684807034959465659490343[/DhtmlXQ_move_1_17_2]
[DhtmlXQ_move_1_13_3]67872728383728268782424182320747[/DhtmlXQ_move_1_13_3]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_13_4]49480807676242414858265658485646[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_13_4]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/dispbbs.asp%3Fboardid%3D48%26replyid%3D133368%26id%3D19907%26skin%3D0%26page%3D1%26star%3D1[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

蛟川鱼 · 发表于 2008-8-4 08:38:00

还是黑胜:

[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999999948994799579959999999999999999999429999993799109999999939[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]5979101757673727797817184838187838397808394927264959265659495646495908076762424162524647[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_11_1]3938080738392737394937366762424162023637[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_11_1]
[DhtmlXQ_move_1_17_2]67683646684807034959465659490343[/DhtmlXQ_move_1_17_2]
[DhtmlXQ_move_1_13_3]67872728383728268782424182320747[/DhtmlXQ_move_1_13_3]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_13_4]49480807676242414858265658485646[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_13_4]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_3_5]79783736575936764838767838397876595876464725171825474647581847493938494838394818[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_3_5]
[DhtmlXQ_move_5_11_6]3938763638483646[/DhtmlXQ_move_5_11_6]
[DhtmlXQ_move_5_11_7]39497646[/DhtmlXQ_move_5_11_7]
[DhtmlXQ_move_5_11_8]5955763639493646[/DhtmlXQ_move_5_11_8]
[DhtmlXQ_move_5_13_9]58481714394914444959465659495658[/DhtmlXQ_move_5_13_9]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/dispbbs.asp%3Fboardid%3D48%26id%3D19907%26star%3D2%26page%3D1[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

蛟川鱼 · 发表于 2008-8-4 08:43:00

征西局大退车变例，对付红方炮四平二的方法，就是第18楼的招法。

蛟川鱼 · 发表于 2008-8-4 11:23:00

18楼还不是红方最顽强的应法,有谁能找出红方的应法来呢？

蛟川鱼 · 发表于 2008-8-8 14:47:00

如下图，红车三退二，准备下步退炮打卒，似乎是紧着。现轮黑走，黑有一系列的妙着可以取胜。你能想到取胜之道吗？

[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999999948994799579959999999999999999999429999993799109999999939[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]5979101779783736575942415969171969614140616719106769[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/dispbbs.asp%3Fboardid%3D48%26replyid%3D133750%26id%3D19907%26skin%3D0%26page%3D1%26star%3D2[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

[此贴子已经被作者于2008-8-8 14:52:21编辑过]

蛟川鱼 · 发表于 2008-9-16 16:50:00

长时间无人拆解,今将胜法公布:

[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999999948994799699978999999999999999999409999993699109999999939[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]36767868766648581011693966685859686739371141595841713731717931717959472567662547665658485657[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_2_1]48387678383978766968764668481012394912424959465659495658[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_2_1]
[DhtmlXQ_move_1_8_3]686710176760404160304647[/DhtmlXQ_move_1_8_3][DhtmlXQ_move_1_8_2]47251030[/DhtmlXQ_move_1_8_2]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_4_4]686710176939176739696768483866163839163639496818696040416061414061111878117178187178181278183646[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_4_4]
[DhtmlXQ_move_6_18_5]6862364662671242[/DhtmlXQ_move_6_18_5]
[DhtmlXQ_move_4_16_6]696818126818364618171242[/DhtmlXQ_move_4_16_6]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_14_7]37277177272040414729777920236768585968482327484959587929[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_14_7]
[DhtmlXQ_move_7_22_8]58576848232779772725484625557779575846485859484959587959552549462947464758594757[/DhtmlXQ_move_7_22_8]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_14_9]370771770700404147296727000877780807272858577877070328480333484633537779575846485859484959587959532349462947464758594757[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_14_9]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_14_10]585971775958676858576866[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_14_10]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_14_11]584871774838676838397737[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_14_11]
[DhtmlXQ_move_11_16_12]4849676949487737[/DhtmlXQ_move_11_16_12]
[DhtmlXQ_move_11_16_13]4858676858576866[/DhtmlXQ_move_11_16_13]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/dispbbs.asp%3FboardID%3D48%26ID%3D19907%26star%3D3%26page%3D4[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

蛟川鱼 · 发表于 2008-9-16 16:53:00

关键是21楼第7回合红方车三退二是败着！

hzsjy · 发表于 2008-9-16 17:03:00

QUOTE:

以下是引用蛟川鱼在2008-9-16 16:50:00的发言：

长时间无人拆解,今将胜法公布:

[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999999948994799699978999999999999999999409999993699109999999939[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]36767868766648581011693966685859686739371141595841713731717931717959472567662547665658485657[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_2_1]48387678383978766968764668481012394912424959465659495658[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_2_1]
[DhtmlXQ_move_1_8_3]686710176760404160304647[/DhtmlXQ_move_1_8_3][DhtmlXQ_move_1_8_2]47251030[/DhtmlXQ_move_1_8_2]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_4_4]686710176939176739696768483866163839163639496818696040416061414061111878117178187178181278183646[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_4_4]
[DhtmlXQ_move_6_18_5]6862364662671242[/DhtmlXQ_move_6_18_5]
[DhtmlXQ_move_4_16_6]696818126818364618171242[/DhtmlXQ_move_4_16_6]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_14_7]37277177272040414729777920236768585968482327484959587929[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_14_7]
[DhtmlXQ_move_7_22_8]58576848232779772725484625557779575846485859484959587959552549462947464758594757[/DhtmlXQ_move_7_22_8]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_14_9]370771770700404147296727000877780807272858577877070328480333484633537779575846485859484959587959532349462947464758594757[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_14_9]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_14_10]585971775958676858576866[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_14_10]
[DhtmlXQ_move_0_14_11]584871774838676838397737[/DhtmlXQ_move_0_14_11]
[DhtmlXQ_move_11_16_12]4849676949487737[/DhtmlXQ_move_11_16_12]
[DhtmlXQ_move_11_16_13]4858676858576866[/DhtmlXQ_move_11_16_13]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/dispbbs.asp%3FboardID%3D48%26ID%3D19907%26star%3D3%26page%3D4[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

第２着走车三进一会如何？

蛟川鱼 · 发表于 2008-9-16 19:44:00

[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999999948994799699978999999999999999999409999993699109999999939[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]36766968764668671017[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/dispbbs.asp%3FboardID%3D48%26ID%3D19907%26star%3D3%26page%3D1[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

hzsjy · 发表于 2008-9-16 20:18:00

QUOTE:

以下是引用蛟川鱼在2008-9-16 19:44:00的发言：
[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999999948994799699978999999999999999999409999993699109999999939[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]36766968764668671017[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/dispbbs.asp%3FboardID%3D48%26ID%3D19907%26star%3D3%26page%3D1[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

蛟川鱼 · 发表于 2008-9-17 08:25:00

[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999999948994799679978999999999999999999409999994699179999999939[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]676040414838464738391718606947467888181169631131887846367838366663336669[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/dispbbs.asp%3FboardID%3D48%26ID%3D19907%26star%3D3%26page%3D1[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

[此贴子已经被作者于2008-9-17 8:34:16编辑过]

hzsjy · 发表于 2008-9-17 12:47:00

QUOTE:

以下是引用蛟川鱼在2008-9-17 8:25:00的发言：

[DhtmlXQ]
[DhtmlXQ_ver]www_dpxq_com[/DhtmlXQ_ver]
[DhtmlXQ_init]500,350[/DhtmlXQ_init]
[DhtmlXQ_binit]9999999948994799679978999999999999999999409999994699179999999939[/DhtmlXQ_binit]
[DhtmlXQ_movelist]676040414838464738391718606947467888181169631131887846367838366663336669[/DhtmlXQ_movelist]
[DhtmlXQ_refer]http%3A//www.hgchess.com/%0D%0Ahttp%3A//www.hgchess.com/bbs/dispbbs.asp%3FboardID%3D48%26ID%3D19907%26star%3D3%26page%3D1[/DhtmlXQ_refer]
[DhtmlXQ_generator]www.dpxq.com[/DhtmlXQ_generator]
[/DhtmlXQ]

嗯．
第６着好棋．

667 · 发表于 2009-3-14 23:56:28

王首成 23:52:32
667兄您好，今日白宏宽棋友将大退车新变着法贴出，取得突破性进展，真是好消息！我看了一下着法，只要将十一回合红改走车六退二将5退1车六退五即和！并且红车四进七后黑走将5退1或车4平5均和！麻烦您把我的观点贴出去！
（您的好友正在使用手机QQ，详情请咨询您的好友或点击：http://mobile.qq.com/?c）

667 · 发表于 2009-3-14 23:58:26

王首成 23:54:59
黑车4进7的凶着，弱点是车底头，有一利必有一弊，真是相生相克！

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